Home > Fiqh issues, Ibaadah, Jihad > Our ability to fight Jihad in present day times and what is compulsory in times of weakness

Our ability to fight Jihad in present day times and what is compulsory in times of weakness


Sheikh Uthaymeen said “We have been ordered to do Jihad, but have we been ordered to do Jihad if we haven’t got weapons like our enemies”?

“No, because this is from the door of throwing yourselves into destruction, but it is  compulsory for us to prepare until we are able to establish the obligation of Jihad because whatever is needed to establish an obligation becomes an obligation itself” (End of quote) Sharh Asiysa Ashariah, pg 59, Explanation of Islamic Legislated Politics.

Sheikh Saalih al Fawzaan said “How many muslims have been killed because of the reckless actions of the Juhaal (the ignorant) which has angered the kuffar and they are stronger than us so they destroy the Muslims with a devastating killing wa la hawla wa quwata ila billah and these foolhardy people call this Jihad”!!! “And this not from jihad because they have not established its conditions and not fulfilled its pillars so this is not Jihad, this is just transgression which Allah did not Order (Jihad Anwarnuha wa Ahkaamuha). Jihad, Its types and its Rulings, pg 120, Sheikh Hamd Uthmaan

Translated and posted by Jafar

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Categories: Fiqh issues, Ibaadah, Jihad
  1. Abu Muhammad
    June 24, 2010 at 23:11

    Assalamu Alaikum wa Rahmatullahi wa Barakatuh

    Brother, what are the conditions that Sheikh Saalih al Fawzaan was refering to?

    BarakAllahu Feek

    Wassalamu Alaikum wa Rahmatullahi wa Barakatuh

    • June 25, 2010 at 16:04

      Walaikum salam wa rahmutullah

      Some of the conditions the ulama mention is 1: physical Ability of the army or the individual 2:clear aims and objectives of the Jihad 3:clear distintion of the battle lines(the Muslims should not be in the line of fire).These conditions all have their evidences

      • Abu Muhammad
        June 25, 2010 at 20:13

        Brother, do you know whether this is referring to offensive or defensive Jihad?

        BarakAllahu Feek

  2. June 26, 2010 at 00:06

    Ahki as for ability(qudra)its applicable in offensive and defensive Jihad as for aims and objective the aims of a defensive jihad are known to defend ones deen and the Muslim lands as for offensive jihad its is to spread the deen of Allah and to make worship for him alone,and the separating of battle lines get in contact with the people of knowledge and ask them if this applies in both situations Allhu walam

  3. Abu Muhammad
    June 26, 2010 at 04:39

    Before I reply to that, do you have any sorces to where you got that from?

    BarakAllahu feek ya Akhi :)

  4. June 26, 2010 at 07:46

    Yes akhi I posted about seven conditions of Jihad on this blog that I translated from a book called: Jihad its types and its rulings and the clear distinction between it and chaos the author was shaykh hamd uthman from Kuwait and he was one the students of sheikh uthaymeen(rahimullah) all the conditions were sourced with the proofs and references so please refer back to these post for proofs and sources
    BarakAllahufeek

  5. Aadil
    June 30, 2010 at 11:55

    AsalamAlaykum

    So what are we meant to do if we are being attacked?

    It seems to me this is just another excuse by the saudis and arab states to act cowardly. Look at the mujahideen in afghanistan they don’t even have 1% of the military capability of the US/NATO forces yet they are unstoppable and are getting stronger by the day, Allah is the one to provide rizq, to provide strength and to provide victory, just look at the success Allah is giving them for their jihad fisabilillah. We can’t always back out by making excuses, the ummah is being humiliated everyday because of refusing to the command of Allah to defend themselves.

    JazakhAllah khair

    • Abu Muhammad
      June 30, 2010 at 12:34

      Wa ‘Alaikum Assalam wa Rahmatullahi wa Barakatuh

      1) Please do not insult scholars akhi :)

      2) Indeed, and that is only by the will of the all Mighty. Please read Signs of ar Rahman by sheikh Abdullah Azzam

      Wassalamu Alaikum wa Rahmatullahi wa Barakatuh

    • June 30, 2010 at 19:59

      Walaikum salam
      akhi Aadil I empathize with your frustration with the current state of the Ummah,but we cant move according our frustration or our emotions to answer your question”So what are we meant to do if we are being attacked”
      The Ulama have discussed this Issue in the fiqh of of jihad and based on the following ayat” O Prophet (Muhammad SAW)! Urge the believers to fight. If there are twenty steadfast persons amongst you, they will overcome two hundred, and if there be a hundred steadfast persons they will overcome a thousand of those who disbelieve, because they (the disbelievers) are people who do not understand.
      Now Allah has lightened your (task), for He knows that there is weakness in you. So if there are of you a hundred steadfast persons, they shall overcome two hundred, and if there are a thousand of you, they shall overcome two thousand with the Leave of Allah. And Allâh is with As-Sâbirin (the patient ones, etc.). (Al-Anfal 8:65,66)they have deduced the following points 1:If the Muslims have got less than 50% of their enemy’s capability to fight it is permissible to flee the battlefield and there is no sin on them based on the above ayah 2:If the Muslims have less than 50%capability to fight their enemy and if they stand and fight they are almost certain to be destroyed and wiped out then they said its is impermissible to stand and fight based on the saying of Allah”And don’t throw yourselves with your own hands to destruction(2:195).In the battle of mu-ta when the sahaba who numbered 3000 and faced 200,000 Romans done a tactical retreat when khlalid bin waleed was the general the prophet described this retreat as a “victory”did khaleed ibn waleed gain complete victory over the Romans?no was khalid bin waleed a cause for preserving the lives of the sahaba? yes this was a victory.Which is one the the objectives of the sharia to persevere life.Adil you described the insurgents in Afghanistan as “mujahadeen”and whats happening their as “Jihad” first question which of the Ulama has given a fatawaa that Afghanistan is “jihad” like they did in the Afghan war that took place in the 1980,s or the Bosnian war that took place in the early and mid 90,s the answer is none.You describe US/NATO forces as”Unstoppable” how many British troops have died in ten years of war?300 how many Afghans have died in ten years of war?probably hundreds of thousands does this sound like an “Unstoppable” force, So Adil the Ulama are not making excuses its just that they have a greater understanding of the religion than us and the current situation of the Muslims which is one of severe weakness. Akhi Abu muhhamad Abdullah Azzam(rahimullah)was a mujahid yes but he was not one of the Ulama. barakullafeekum

      • Aadil
        July 1, 2010 at 09:14

        Asalam Alaykum akhi

        Can you tell me which ulama have come to the conclusion that you need atleast ‘50%’ of the capability of the enemy to fight?

        I do not see any logic in this, in such case not a single muslim nation has ‘50%’ capability of enemy forces, either in the army, navy or airforce – that means according to this fatwa not a single muslim can carry out defensive jihad.

        You talk about how few soldiers compared to afghans mujahids have died, in a war numbers do not matter. During the soviet invasion of afghanistan 500,000 mujahideen were made shaheed and only 15000 russians died, but who won in the end? who retained their honour and fought for Allah and their people? who got victory in the end?

        I’m telling you these type of rulings made by certain ulema cannot be taken seriously, if we are meant to live by these rulings then not a single muslim could lift their hands to defend themselves, personally I believe these rulings are made to satisfy the saud govt and their acts of cowardice. Allah has commanded us to defend ourselves, If we were to standby whilst our sisters are being raped and our families being massacred I’m pretty sure on the day of Qiyamah we will be asked about this. If we die in the path of Allah so we will become shaheed, we have nothing to worry about.

        The afghan mujahideen currently control 2/3 of afghanistan, do they Tdo this by sitting in their homes? They’ve killed more than 2000 troops, was it done by abandoning jihad? The kaffir govts are being pressurized to leave the country because they keep loosing troops, would this have happened if people just sat at home and worried about not having ‘50% capability?

        By Allah, He is the one who grants victory, who provides for the efforts in the path of Allah, He is the one who helps those who stive in His cause. InshAllah US/NATO will be forced out of afghanistan just like the soviets. I pray that Allah gives us the strength to speak and fight for the truth

        Waasalaamu Alaykum

      • July 1, 2010 at 14:34

        Walaikum salam
        Akhi adil I did not say that you need 50% of the capability of the enemy to fight them if you read my quote I said if you have less than 50% capability of the enemy it is is permissible to flee from the battlefield based upon the ayah there is a difference. And it is permissible to fight with less than 50%capability as long as you believe you will not be wiped out please go back and read my quote.Akhi Aadil we do not base our deen on bbc news reports rather we base it on evidences from the quran and the sunnah with the understanding of our salaf.All of what you just posted is just a rant with no dalil.Akhi In afghanistan there is a government and as long as the ruler is a muslim the sharia requires those Afghans there to obey the ruler in that which is in obedience to Allaah and it is haram to rebel against the oppressive Muslim ruler and this has many evidences.So what is the evidence that Muhammad khaizai is a kafir?Aadil please bring dalil or remain Silent this is the art of debate We salafees dont base our deen on our intellect and news reports just the adilal(evidences)no rants or emotions or intellectual somersaulting.barakullfekum

  6. Aadil
    June 30, 2010 at 19:48

    Sorry I did mean to sound like I was insulting any scholars

    Assalam Alaykum

    • Abu Muhammad
      June 30, 2010 at 20:26

      Wa ‘Alaikum Assalam wa Rahmatullahi wa Barakatuh

      Akhi, are you then saying the Mujahideen, and I treat them as so and so should you for they are figting for Allah’s deen to be the greatest in those lands, should just drop their weapons and leave for their homes and let themselves, their wives, children, brothers, sisters, fathers, mothers, ect be massacerd? By Allah is this not “Wa la tuqu biaydikum ila atahlukah”? Now brother what you have said is unreasonable and many ulama have supported the Mujahideen.

      You mentioned the story of Khalid ibn Waleed, but this is a different situation as it was offensive Jihad and they where attacking. In Ahganistan they are being attacked and it is OBLIGATORY on them to defend their land, their deen, their families, ect and repel the enemy.

      Finally take the advice of ibn taymiyah, imam ahmad and ibn al mubarak (may Allah have mercy on all of them) and refer not the matters of jihad except to those who have dusted their feet in that path. As Allah swt said “walladheena jahadu feena la nahdiyanahum subuluna” and those who have done jihad in our cause, we will guide them to our path.

      Looking forward to your reply akhi al kareem :)
      Wassalamu Alaikum wa Rahmatullahi wa Barakatuh

      • July 1, 2010 at 08:53

        Akhi abu Muhammad
        The Issue is simple and not complicated Just name one of the major Salafi Ulama Who have said that afghanistan is Jihad as these affairs are from the Major Issues that have to be returned to the highest level of the ulama Allah said”When there comes to them a matter about public security or fear they spread it around.If only they had referred it to the messenger and those charged with authority among them then the ones who can draw correct conclusions from it would have known about it(surah nisa ayah 83).

        And what we have learned from our shuyook is “every fighting that the Ulama have not given fatawaa regarding stating that it is jihad,then it is the fighting of fitnah”.So akhi Abu Muhammed either name the Ulama or we then Know that your just following your desires and the Issue is closed.barakullafekum

  7. Aadil
    July 1, 2010 at 10:00

    asalafiyaleicester :Akhi abu Muhammad
    And what we have learned from our shuyook is “every fighting that the Ulama have not given fatawaa regarding stating that it is jihad,then it is the fighting of fitnah”.So akhi Abu Muhammed either name the Ulama or we then Know that your just following your desires and the Issue is closed.barakullafekum

    Can you tell me why our sheikhs will condemn the ‘fighting of fitna’ yet fail to condemn the saud govt’s alliance with the US and all the acts off terror by the US against muslims? Saudi let the US set up military bases inside saudi during the iraq war, did our sheikhs condemn this?

  8. Aadil
    July 1, 2010 at 21:59

    asalafiyaleicester :Walaikum salamAkhi adil I did not say that you need 50% of the capability of the enemy to fight them if you read my quote I said if you have less than 50% capability of the enemy it is is permissible to flee from the battlefield based upon the ayah there is a difference. And it is permissible to fight with less than 50%capability as long as you believe you will not be wiped out please go back and read my quote.Akhi Aadil we do not base our deen on bbc news reports rather we base it on evidences from the quran and the sunnah with the understanding of our salaf.All of what you just posted is just a rant with no dalil.Akhi In afghanistan there is a government and as long as the ruler is a muslim the sharia requires those Afghans there to obey the ruler in that which is in obedience to Allaah and it is haram to rebel against the oppressive Muslim ruler and this has many evidences.So what is the evidence that Muhammad khaizai is a kafir?Aadil please bring dalil or remain Silent this is the art of debate We salafees dont base our deen on our intellect and news reports just the adilal(evidences)no rants or emotions or intellectual somersaulting.barakullfekum

    AsalamAlaykum

    Here is your dalil akhi:

    “The first obligation after Iman is the repulsion of the enemy aggressor who assaults the religion and the worldly affairs”. Ibn Taymia.

    “If you march not forth, He will punish you with a painful torment and will replace you with another people, and you cannot harm Him at all, and Allah is able to do all things.” (Surah at Tauba: Verse 39).

    Sheikh Ibn Taymia says on this topic: “About the defensive jihad, which is repelling an aggressor, is the most tasking type of jihad. As agreed upon by everyone, it is obligatory to protect the religion and what is sacred. The fIrst obligation after Iman is the repulsion of the enemy aggressor who assaults the religion and the worldly affairs. There are no conditional requirements such as supplies or transport, rather he is fought with all immediate capability .The Ulama, our peers and others have spoken about this.”

    Ibn Kathir said: ” Allah the Exalted ordered that everybody march forward with the Messenger of Allah (saw), (the General March) in the expedition of Tabuk to fight the enemies of Allah, the unbelieving Romans of the People of the Book”. Bukhari has written a chapter in Sahih Bukhari (entitled: The Chapter On The Obligation of Marching Forward and What is Required from Jihad and Intention for It) and quoted this verse. It was a general call because it became known to the Muslims that the Romans were gathering on the borders of the Arabian Peninsula and were preparing to invade Medina. So what is the situation when the Kuffar enter a Muslim country, does not the march forward become the ultimate priority? Abu Talha (ra) said about the Exalted’s words: “…light or heavy…old or young” (Surah at Tauba:Verse 41), Allah did not listen to anyone’s excuse”. And Hasan al Basri said: “in hardship and in ease.” Ibn Taymia said in Majmua al Fatawa 28/358: “If the enemy intends an attack upon the Muslims, then repelling him becomes obligatory upon the population under attack as well as the population not under attack. The Exalted has said:

    I am no one to make tafkir of the afghan govt, but a govt that commits treason, abandons the obligatory jihad and joins forces with the invading kuffar to fight for a kufr system of ‘democracy’ cannot be a govt in the first place. A govt that never existed in the first place and was put in place by the kuffar is no official govt.

    You salafees seems to bring up the same argument of not rebelling against the ‘muslim ruler’, in this case that excuse will not work as it was the taliban were the official ‘muslim ruler’s and its the afghan puppet govt that is rebelling against them, not the other way round. So what happens to those who rebel against a muslim govt? Surely they must be killed to prevent their fitna, no?

    May Allah guide us all to the truth

  9. Abu Muhammad
    July 2, 2010 at 01:15

    Fatwaa on Afghanistan
    by Ash-Shaikh Yahyaa Al-Hajooree
    Translated by Abu Sumayyah Aqeel Walker
    All praise is due to Allaah, and may prayers of blessing and peace
    be upon the Messenger of Allaah, his family and his companions.
    Ash-Shaikh Yahyaa Al-Hajooree – may Allaah preserve him – was askedwhat is the ruling concerning the Jihaad in Afghanistan? What is the
    status of the Taliban movement? Do you advise the students ofknowledge to go there?

    The Shaikh responded by saying: In reference to what is related tothe Jihaad of the Afghanis with the Americans, there is no need for
    extra discussion concerning it. There is no more to be said from the aspect of the clarity of the matter of fighting the disbelievers. If
    fighting against the disbelievers is not Jihaad then what is Jihaad?!

    Our Lord, Glory be unto Him, the Most High says: “O you who believe,fight against those who are near you among the disbelievers, and let them find harshness in you.”

    And He says, “It (Jihaad) has been permitted for those who fight because they have been oppressed and indeed Allaah is capable of helping them.”

    And Allaah, the Mighty and Majestic, commanded to make Jihaad against the disbelievers with the wealth and the self (physically).

    Thus, consequently this is a Jihaad that is occuring among the people of Afghanistan and there is no doubt about it. And I do not think that any person who has knowledge and knows the evidences of the Book of Allaah and the Sunnah of His Messenger which prove Al-Jihaad, define Al-Jihaad, and explain Al-Jihaad -I do not think that he would say that this is not Jihaad! I do not think this (that someone of knowlege would say that). Unless his sight has been blinded!

    In reference to what relates to going to them, then (I say) , “where will they go?” For indeed they (the Afghanis) are besieged and they have been locked in (surrounded and cut off). These people, we ask Allaah to help them aagainst the disbelievers. I mean the Mujaahideen of Afghanistan. These people, by Allaah oh brothers,

    Verily Allaah (SWT) has raised the flag of Islaam with them in these times.

    Particularly in these days. And He (Allaah) has lifted the heads of the Arabs by them (the Afghani Mujaahideen). Were it not for Allaah (SWT)and then these heroes who have stood in the face
    (i.e. stood up to) America, it is possible that America would crush the Arabs with these weapons of destruction, unless Allaah willed otherwise, and He guides others besides them (the Arabs). So your Lord has power over all things. So the conclusion of this is that they are Mujaahidoon, and there is no doubt about it, and that it is
    necessary for the Muslims to call upon Allaah, the Mighty and Majestic to help them against the disbelievers.

    And indeed our Lord (SWT) said at the end of Surah Al-Baqarah (So help us against the disbelieving people.)

    Meaning in His statement concerning the supplication of the believers. Thus, it is necessary for the Muslim to supplicate for the defeat of the disbelievers and the aid of Islaam and the Muslims. This is the concluding meaning of this.

    If we knew of there being any way possible to reach there (Afghanistan) for whoever intends to join the Jihaad and for whoever loves to do that, and he has a break from his seeking Sharee’ah knowledge (Islamic studies), and he has no mandatory work that he must do in regards to the religion of Allaah, such that if he goes (for Jihaad) then this responsibility would be neglected, and similaar to that: yes, we say to him , “If you wish, go. Yet, it is not obligatory upon you as an individual obligation (‘Ayniyyan),

    rather it is a Kifaa’iyya obligation (if some Muslims do it… that suffices the rest), as we have explained before in the questions of the people of Hadhramawt.

    So this is the concluding reply, which has been mentioned above.

    We ask Allaah, the Almighty, to debase America and whoever supports it, and that He destroy it. And we ask Allaah (SWT) to help the Afghani Mujaahideen and that He help Islaam and the Muslims.What has been mentioned is sufficient concerning this, if Allaah wills. And the Afghanis are considered Mujaahideen now, and this is sufficient in regards to this issue.

    In reference to the correct belief… I know that they (the Taliban) are Maatureediyyah (in Aqeedah; a deviant sect similar to the Ash’arees).

    Similar can be said about Usaamah (bin Laden). I know that he is a Jihaadee (i.e. one who exagarates[ghuloo’] in Jihaad ) and he has the problem of Takfeer (declaring Muslims to be Kaafirs). He is a Takfeeree who is quick to make Takfeer (call Muslims Kaafirs).

    However, brothers, we have already mentioned that it is necessary to make du’aa for them, for they are Muslims, and indeed Allaah has helped Islaam by them. We have already mentioned that Shaikh ul-Islaam (Ibn Taymiyyah) fought along with those who are worse than these people as you all know. Therefore, it is not desired that the person look into this matter (of their deviance) and not make du’aa for them. Look at their incorrect beliefs and clarify the matter for the people concerning what they are upon. And make sure that the people are not deceived by them and their erroneous beliefs that they are upon. However, regarding the matter of the Muslim with the disbeliever (in comparison), then the Muslim is more honorable with Allaah than the disbeliever and more honored than the disbeliever, more so than all that fills the Dunyaa (this world). The Muslim is better than all that the Dunyaa contains of disbelievers who are filthy and despicable.”

    (The end. Taken from the tape “Al-Ajwibatul-Hajooriyyah

    ‘alal-Asilatil-Hadeethiyyah” – Hajooree’s Answers concerning Contemporary Questions)

  10. Abu Muhammad
    July 2, 2010 at 01:25

    Brother,

    asalafiyaleicester :

    Akhi abu Muhammad
    The Issue is simple and not complicated Just name one of the major Salafi Ulama Who have said that afghanistan is Jihad as these affairs are from the Major Issues that have to be returned to the highest level of the ulama Allah said”When there comes to them a matter about public security or fear they spread it around.If only they had referred it to the messenger and those charged with authority among them then the ones who can draw correct conclusions from it would have known about it(surah nisa ayah 83).
    And what we have learned from our shuyook is “every fighting that the Ulama have not given fatawaa regarding stating that it is jihad,then it is the fighting of fitnah”.So akhi Abu Muhammed either name the Ulama or we then Know that your just following your desires and the Issue is closed.barakullafekum

    Did you know brother, Salahudin went against the fataawa of the scholars at the time. Now let me ask you, If the mujahideen abandoned the Jihad in Afganistan because of the fatawa of these salafi (I really don’t like using this term) ulema will the deaths if all the innocent people be on the shoulders of the ‘ulema’?

    What is different from this Jihad in Afghanistan and the previous one? The people being attacked are the same, the lands are the same, the only difference is the enemy, so why do we have such a difference within the ulema’s fatawa?

  11. July 2, 2010 at 16:46

    I am very happy that we are discussing this subject based upon ilm and not emotions and rants. In response to whether the afghan government is legitamate or not then ahlu Sunnah believe there are three ways that the Muslim ruler becomes legitimate
    1)shura(consultation) as was the case with the appointment of Abu Bakr and as umar selected six of the companions who appointed uthman
    2)The Muslim ruler appointing a successor as Abu bakr appointed umar
    3)The ruler that becomes mutagalib(takes power by force) Ibn hajar he said in fathul bari v9 page 13 hadith no7053)”the Ijma(consensus) of the fuqaha that it is compulsory to obey the ruler that becomes mutagalib and Jihad with him and obedience to him is better than rebelling against him”.
    Muhammad ibn abdul wahab said” the Imams have agreed from every mathab that whoever becomes mutagalib on a country or two countries he has the right to be the ruler in all affairs”(aldurur siniya v7page239)
    So there you have it any Muslim ruler whenever he becomes dominant (mutagalib) whether he uses the kuffar to achieve this or not he has the right to rulership’
    Adil your statement where you said” I am no one to make tafkir of the afghan govt, but a govt that commits treason, abandons the obligatory jihad and joins forces with the invading kuffar to fight for a kufr system of ‘democracy’ cannot be a govt in the first place. A govt that never existed in the first place and was put in place by the kuffar is no official govt.
    Committing treason does not necessarily make you a non Muslim as hatib ibn abi balata revealed some of the secrets of the prophet before the conquest of Mecca by sending a letter to the musrikeen and he was not judged as a kafir this Issue has conditions but this is not our topic
    Abandoning jihad is not kufr akbar unless you believe jihad is not part of the legislation of Islam and simply abadoning it can range from being a sin to being permissible in times of weakness.
    As for you saying they are fighting for democracy. This is something you will have establish from them directly without bbc,or cnn news reports did you establish this? Did you split open their hearts and look into their niyah.
    Another point to bear in mind is that the Iraq government was established in exactly the same way none of the scholars say they are not a legitimate government as you say Adil so Adil your statement of illegitimate government is batil and against the manhaj of ahlu Sunnah and none of the contemporary scholars say what you’re saying so what is it Adil are All the ulama astray or do you know better than them?
    Akhi Abu Muhammad that tape of sheikh yahya hajooree is from the year 2001 when the kuffar first invaded and there was no Muslim government present at that time so he saw that it was Jihad. The situation has changed now and there is a Muslim government present now. I remember very Cleary when he said what he said .If you contact the sheikh now you will find his position very different and it will comply with the way of Ahlus sunnah wal Jammah contact him and ask him please and get back to me.
    As for the question why did the scholars rule that the afghan war in the 80,s was a legislated jihad and the present one they have not declared Jihad. That is because the ruler of the afghans at that time was Dostum who was a communist and communism is clear Kufr because it calls to atheism as for the afghan Ruler he still ascribes himself to Islam and calls himself a muslim,and simply ruling with manmade laws does not make him kafir unless he makes it halal to do so this is the position of the ulama past and present.
    In conclusion the statement of Ibn taymeeyah that you brought Adil and other applies when the kuffar Invade our lands as for when there is a legitimate Muslim government(whether you call it puppet or not) which can come about in one of three ways then obedience is obligatory. Just pick up the phone and ask the people of knowledge and they will verify what I’m saying but if you want to follow your desires and quote statement of Scholars out of context then we leave you to yourself.

  12. Aadil
    July 2, 2010 at 18:56

    Before the karzai govt were put in place by the kuffar, who was the legitamate muslim govt? It was the taliban

    So if the taliban were the actual muslim govt, is it not the karzai govt that is rebbelling against them?

    You said:
    “So there you have it any Muslim ruler whenever he becomes dominant (mutagalib) whether he uses the kuffar to achieve this or not he has the right to rulership”

    Can you give me proof that we can use to kuffar to achieve rulership? Can you also give me proof that we can allie with the kuffar and fight/rebel against the existing legitamate muslim govt to acheive rulership? This seems a contradiction of your statements

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